April 23rd, 2007
|02:23 pm - Some days, I'm more Jewish than others, it seems. . .|
So, apparently I'm now Jewish, and this is a bad thing?
(special thanks to sleepingwolf, who was astonished to stumble across this reference to me and my OL "editorship")
Somehow, someone on the "Vanguard News Network Forum" revealed me as part of the "Jewish problem". On one level it's disturbing to think that someone has my name and thinks I'm part of some imaginary problem or conspiracy, but this is balanced by a very heavy amusement at the fact that while I'm part of the problem, the guy is leaving it to everyone else to guess my "ethnic origin", because he obviously can't think of any other people in ADF who *might* be Jewish, but needs one more to prove his point.
I dropped the quote behind the cut, as well as the link, because I don't want to cause anyone's work to wonder why they're looking at white supremacy websites, but I quoted it in full, because damn: it's not every day that you get lumped in with a bunch of people who are actually pretty darn cool and even chosen by God. I mean, the guy practically blessed me (in a weird way) by insinuating that I'm Jewish.
For the record, I'm not the editor of Oak Leaves, either.
For the most part, this kind of stuff is weirdly frightening and amusing to me. It's frightening for all the obvious reasons, and the frightening aspects of it should not and cannot be understated. But the reason that I find it amusing is because, you know, people actually believe this stuff. That alone is just so improbable to me, so deeply and abysmally idiotic, that I cannot help but think, "Gee, it's like their whole life is one huge, insane joke that doesn't end!"
Either way, I'd rather be kinda Jewish than all stupid.
I think I'll have gefilte fish for dinner.
From: http://www.vnnforum.com/archive/index.php/t-19102.html, under a post from a guy called "Uncle John" (talk about creepy). . .
"The so-called Pagan Movement has lots of dabblers but few dedicated believers. Furthermore, it is riddled with jews. Margot Adler, a Gardinerian 'witch' who wrote the seminal directory of American pagan organizations, Drawing Down the Moon, is a jew (she also has a fat job at NPR).
"Garman Lord", the head of the "Theodish Rice" (Anglo-Saxon Wodenism) is (was) a jew. (I think he's dead).
The founding 'archdruid' of the largest American druid organization, Ar nDraiocht Fein (no irish fonts, sorry) is the jew Isaac Bonewits. The current editor of the ADF journal, "Oak Leaves" is named Michael J. Dangler. I leave it to you to guess his ethnic origin. There was even a jew who was briefly in the inner circle of the Asatru Alliance (head of the Raven Kindred of New Jersey).
Pagan organizations are usually little more than a website. Here is a typical example: www. sahsam.org . I picked this one because it is particularly visual and well done. The fellow who runs this outfit -- the 'alderman' -- has councils and issues 'abannings' and has a seal which he can stamp on stuff and...everything! Certainly it's a lot more fun than (I'm guessin') being an Assistant Network Administrator in Norfork, Va. Lots of computer people are attracted to neo-paganism.
I was involved in all this for years. 'Wicca' is the worst, with the weediest men and the heaviest, most feminist, women, but most of it is pretty bad. Folkish Asatru/Odinism/Irminism is by far the best and cleanest branch of the movement.
If it hadn't been for Steve McNallan and the Asatru Folk Assembly, for example, "Kenniwick Man" would have been quietly handed over to the Indians by the DOI and the BLM. They did their best to destroy the evidence anyway, and were only stopped when the issue came to the attention of serious anthropologists by way of McNallan's lawsuits.
Current Location: Southeast of Disorder
Current Mood: weird
Current Music: "Pre-You", -JB
So did you inform them that you were not?
Also, its hard to tell here if he's referring that people are of Jewish Religion or Jewish Decent... that would make a huge difference...
Anyways, thats really amusing in its own way.
No, I didn't inform them. I thought about that, and honestly, if I go and protest that I'm *not* Jewish, then I'm doing one of two things:
- Becoming a "Jewish sympathizer", which doesn't improve my lot in their eyes at all, I'm sure, or
- Showing that I agree that being Jewish is a terrible thing and that I don't want to be associated with it.
Besides, telling them
that would just be trolling on their servers, really. And honestly, I can deal with a passing mention on their forums, but I really have no desire to become a high-profile target in their eyes.
So, as far as I'm concerned, my "ethnicity" can remain a mystery to them. It's not like it would make me a different person, anyway: if I'm Jewish or if I'm not, they're still idiots :)
I'm totally weedy!
I've slept with several Jews--including a woman--can I be part of the conspiracy?
Seriously, it's folks like this what turn me off to a lot of Germanic stuff. Way too many racists in there; anyone who mentions Folkish-ness bothers the hell out of me. I'm perfectly happy to do stuff on my own, but it's hard to find a non-racist Germanic group. There is someone in the Philly area; I briefly met them at a Pagan Pride Day a couple of years ago. They had at least two black members, and were very anti-Folkish, but I didn't get their information unfortunately.
And jeez, not the Kennewick Man again! As if all First Nation folk look alike... There are some legitimate mysteries regarding the settlement of North America, but anyone who goes around acting like white guys got here first and everyone else has to leave... Gah! That's not what the evidence says at all!
It's not about what the evidence says. It's about what you say the evidence says!
I don't know how one becomes part of the conspiracy. I think I accidentally fell into it. Maybe if you're not watching where you're going, you're likely to trip and fall into a pit of Jewishness from which you might never escape.
Ewww. . . covered in Jew.
Wow. And I thought I was being irreverent before. . . Anyway, it appears to me to be entirely arbitrary how one becomes part of the conspiracy. More to the point, it seems like these people are so darned afraid of becoming part of it that they have to point fingers at other people.
Kinda like homophobia, it seems that those who have Jewaphobia are really just tiny little people afraid that they, themselves, are what they hate so much.
I think it's funny, I think it's really funny...
They are talking about there being no tradition in paganism and the like, and talking about how paganism broke off of protestantism. o_0
Of course the part about jews being the founders of the ADF & others is even funnier...as if Jewish founders make something bad. It's not like Christianity wasn't founded by Jews *boggle*
Anyone not blinded by ignorance and stupidity should be able to see they are little more then morons.
Honestly, I think they are just jealous because we look better in our white robes XD
Honestly, I think they are just jealous because we look better in our white robes XD
*snickers* Damn tootin'!
LOL! I love the stupid Nazis and their insane excuse conspiracies that only the Japanese ever believed
/Also welcome to the 'other people think that you're Jewish club'!
Thanks for the welcome. Where do I get my membership card?
|Date:||April 23rd, 2007 07:16 pm (UTC)|| |
In related news?
|Date:||April 23rd, 2007 07:23 pm (UTC)|| |
Re: In related news?
How clueless people like him survive infancy I will never understand. I can't even begin to get into how far off he is on the Kenniwick Man issue.
People like him scare me because there are plenty of stupid people out there that will buy into his claims.
I suspect that he's just repeating something he heard. It's not like they do research in White Supremacist School. You just get textbooks with stickers on them saying that evolution is a theory you shouldn't believe, laws saying Creationism is the only form of education allowed, and "abstinence-only" sex education that will solve the world's problems.
What is especially sad about this is that (unless my memory is playing tricks here) Isaac says he's not actually Jewish...just has a name that people assume is Jewish.
I never would have thought that people would consider *my* name Jewish, but apparently it must look that way to someone.
Eh, I don't think that the guy could be bothered to actually do any sort of research. I mean, if you say it, it's true, right?
*raises hand* HI, I'm jewish and a druid to boot...WTF? Man, my dear you face some interesting times.
Yay :) If you're the problem, I totally want to be part of it.
As far as I know, there is no Raven Kindred in New Jersey. http://www.ravenkindred.com/ There was even a jew who was briefly in the inner circle of the Asatru Alliance (head of the Raven Kindred of New Jersey).
I was, for a while, going to a lot of rituals with Raven Kindred South when they were in Germantown, MD (my ex-husband is interested in Asatru) and know people who started Raven Kindred North and South. The person the author is mentioning was a supporter of equality and non-discrimination in Asatru. This person did a lot to try to stop the Neo-Nazi infiltration in modern-day Asatru and was harassed and threatened because of it and left Asatru. Funny thing is - this person wasn't even a Jew as the author of this crap claims.
As you said, people will read this, and believe it. I, of course, am the "heaviest and most feminist" of them all and I DARE anyone to challenge me, the Queen of The Fattest Feminists! Ahem. Sorry.
I bow down, O Queen!
Crazy guy. As if heavy was something to be ashamed of, or feminist an insult. . . I get the visual impression that Uncle John might have some weight on him, too.
"Uncle John" is a creep alright. I'd find it frightening too.
Where are the heaviest most feminist men and scrawny women, I wonder?
I envision a guy opening his old, beat-up van at the school playground and saying to a kid passing by, "Hey, it's your Uncle John! Of course you remember me! I have a lollipop for you! Climb in!"
|Date:||April 23rd, 2007 08:13 pm (UTC)|| |
Crazies, crazies everywhere! How creepy.
From the woodwork, they come out. Like roaches.
Except that I prefer roaches.
Judging from your name, I'd say you're "danglish."
I am an ethnicity all unto myself :) But yeah, "wow" is about right.
|Date:||April 23rd, 2007 10:16 pm (UTC)|| |
Hey, that's what you get for being an esteemed leader in the American Dreidel Foundation!
I suddenly have a strong desire to make Druidic dreidels!
I think they just throw around the term "Jew" as an insult. Like you I would take being called "jew-lover" or something as a compliment. They have a very rich spiritual tradition and culture(s) that have survived extreme persecution for centuries. Definitely something to be admired.
But then, I'm at college being indoctrinated by eevil Jewish Marxist professors, right?
That said, some scholars have suggested the Neo-Pagan community has a disproportionate number of adherents of Jewish background. And the RDNA did have a grove of "Hasidic Druids"...
Re: Asatru- the Heathen community around here is staunchly anti-racist. I think they are outgrowing the 'They must be Nazis" stigma. I think it depends on where you are, but I've only run into White Supremacists online.